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> Spring Update, GOLD, 5-key, and More
Remy
post May 26 2008, 10:49 PM
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Gold support has been added to both versions of the site. Notecount corrections should go in the appropriate thread on Under Construction; secret songs and courses will be forthcoming as data is revealed. Thanks to rmz for pre-propagating the database.

I've also made a few tweaks on both versions of the site to fix some niggling issues; 4.0 is at least functional again, while 3.0 now uses the HS-style ratings for viewuser. There's also been an API fix or two.

Finally:

The coding of 5-key support was done under the assumption that beatmania US would do reasonably well and spawn sequels, which would likely also have 5-key revivals. Instead, sadly, the game flopped and we're not going to see a follow-up, unless Konami decides to throw a curveball in. As I've mentioned a few places, 5-key support was a massive contingency case, which added an extra set of logic to nearly every function of the site. It's a significant reason 4.0 development stalled out (programmer burnout not withstanding).

With this all in mind, I'm announcing the end of 5-key support effective July 1, 2008. I don't take any great pride in cutting support for a feature that a number of people (including myself) have used, but the numbers make it sort of clear. It's been an extreme amount of logic for what amounts to 17 songs.

I don't intend to leave anyone in the lurch, so here's the tentative timeline I have in mind:

5/27 - Announcement of end of support.
6/15 - No more 5-key scores will be accepted via session mode.
6/20 - All users with 5-key data will have a separate XML export generated of just their 5-key data. This XML file will be held until the end of 2008.
7/1 - 5-key functionality will be removed from the site.

Let me know if you feel strongly about this either way.


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chotto kiitena
post May 26 2008, 10:57 PM
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You could just take the 5 key only songs and treat their charts as 7 key hyper charts for the purposes of score entry, right? If you migrated the scores over that'd solve your problems for all the songs except those that are available in both 5 and 7 key mode in BMUS, and that's only a handful IIRC.


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itsgreylolol
post May 26 2008, 11:21 PM
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Use them on [a], there aren't any charts that have a 5k and [a] entry, are there? At least not on BMUS.

Regardless, the only reason I object, is that it messes up DJP, and ultimately, the number of AAAs I have. As odd as it sounds, I really don't want to have to re-number my AAAs, which I will attempt to do if and when this occurs.

That may just be me though.


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All numbers not including EMP+PB
[L7] Left to AAA: 3 (Step Into the New World, Fun, Gambol)
[7k] left to A: 1 (Pluto)
11*s left to clear: 9 (waxing and wanding, tripping contact (remix), The Dirty of Loudness, four pieces of heaven, Blocks, Bleeding Luv, Be OK [b])
12*s Cleared: 5
Ds left in IIDX: 4 (Mendes[b], Icarus[b], four pieces of heaven[b], Mei[a])
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Yasserr
post May 27 2008, 03:52 AM
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awww man, i worked so hard on those 5-key scores, i have like bolds for most of them



oh well


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Remy
post May 27 2008, 09:24 AM
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QUOTE(Xythar @ May 26 2008, 11:57 PM) *
You could just take the 5 key only songs and treat their charts as 7 key hyper charts for the purposes of score entry, right? If you migrated the scores over that'd solve your problems for all the songs except those that are available in both 5 and 7 key mode in BMUS, and that's only a handful IIRC.


11 songs.

QUOTE(itsgreylolol @ May 27 2008, 12:21 AM) *
Use them on [a], there aren't any charts that have a 5k and [a] entry, are there? At least not on BMUS.


5 songs.

Either way, I still have to add a mountain of (new) contingency code to properly label the anothers (or hypers) as 5-key.


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Catastrophe
post May 27 2008, 07:17 PM
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Yeah, I also rocked the fuck out on those 5K charts and got all my best scores there. I guess it's a good thing I never got that 200k on Jam Jam Reggae after all. Because if I did, and my 200k was gone, I'd be sad. Although I'm glad to do it if it makes the coding easier.

Maybe later, after 4.0 and only if anyone still cares, make new songs called "BATTLE BREAKS (5 KEY)" that have only a 7H and 14H. Making 5K a separate level like beginner would've made sense if it meant not having to have two separate songs for 321 Stars. But you have two separate songs for 321 Starts anyway. So you might as well have "TOXIC (5 KEY)" and "TOXIC" as two separate songs.


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Team Ragnarok
post May 27 2008, 08:46 PM
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If it saves you guys extra trouble, I'm all for seeing these go, since there's so few of them anyway.


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QUOTE(XytharDX @ Apr 9 2007, 08:51 AM)
TaQ!NO!!! is my favourite genre of music. I fondly remember such greats as D!X!!Y!!! and sto!IC!!!

QUOTE(Axem Rangers @ Jan 15 2008, 01:34 PM) *
CREEPY RAVE / A/S/L? / RAM

QUOTE(chickensnack @ May 27 2008, 03:33 AM) *
RAVE - OLD - RAM
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rmz
post May 27 2008, 09:04 PM
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AXE THEM in my humble opinion btns.gif
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Adman
post May 28 2008, 04:50 AM
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If there's no simple way to keep them on the site and updateable, then I guess they should go. For the record I'd prefer they didn't, but it sounds like the site as a whole would benefit a lot more from them being gone. If possible, I'd prefer just a simple text file of the scores to be available, I think it'd be more useful to me.

Thanks for the fixing those issues btw, nice to see HS ratings instead of dashes everywhere. aaa.gif


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VaderSeven
post Jun 13 2008, 07:51 PM
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add them in as L7 songs with their normal song title plus 5key. For example.


You would enter a score in session mode for a song named "Emotion 5key" on the "Light7" difficulty.

that way you just have a seperate entry for every 5 key song that takes a l7 spot and does not share a song title with a song that has L7, H, and A charts already.


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Snakesonaplanepl...
post Jun 15 2008, 11:17 AM
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Personally, I'd rather 5-key be kept, since unlike the recent styles of IIDX, 5-key was an actual difficulty in BMUS and 5-key scores actually saved on that game. In DD CS and GOLD CS, you could play the 5key songs' original chart using the 5key modifier, but the scores wouldn't save, and in the case of GOLD CS, were marked as an Assist Clear, which is worthless IMO.

Here's the dilemma I'm facing: When 5key support is axed, I stand to lose 14 AAAs, 6 AAs, 4 As, 8 PCs, and 13 FCs. That's 244 DJP points if you're counting. I have decided not to renumber my AAA count, since I feel like I earned those scores at one point. AAAing a 5key song, however easy, is still an AAA. Of course, we could debate on whether or not I could AAA the same songs on their original 5key mix PSX games, but that's pointless, since Beatmania and IIDX are entirely different games in terms of interfaces, timing, and scoring.

The biggest problem with the 5key support in BMUS is that Konami didn't implement it very well. They only gave you one difficulty, and that was it. No Normal, Hard, and the occasional Another like the older mixes. Of course, had those difficulties been supported, VJArmy would've been an even bigger mess in View User, what with 5Key Normal, 5Key Hard, and 5key Another now cluttering up the page. I guess that's what Retrofuture is for. *sigh*

I'd say keep it for the nubs who are just getting into IIDX and might like to input their 5key scores, but even nubs don't care about 5key at this point, and BMUS is getting harder to find anyway. So I guess I'll go with no more 5key, since i figured it was inevitable anyway, and I'm just Beating_a_Dead_Horse.gif at this point. But before I say final farewells to 5key, I AA'd e-motion 5key in tribute. So long. wink.gif


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SuperWailingBonus
QUOTE (rmz @ Mar 28 2008, 07:03 AM) *
NOW PRESENTING

BEATMANIA IIDX FOURTENN GOLDS FOR THE FAMICOM HOME ENTERTAINMENT SYSTEM

QUOTE (Kaze @ Dec 29 2008, 12:16 AM) *
But they've already relinquished its title of planet!

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Dr. Satan
post Jun 20 2008, 05:33 AM
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I personally hate playing on 5-key after I got used to playing with 7 keys. When BM US came out and the 5-key scores were counted, I felt obligated to fill them in, and it felt like a giant waste of time. happy.gif While a select few 5-key songs may have some historical merit, I don't think they are anything relevant in the age of IIDX domination. I think you could also draw a close comparison between beginner mode and 5-key to some extent, which is to say I don't think it is worth scoring on an internet application.
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BLUST OF WIND
post Jun 20 2008, 11:12 AM
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it really isn't.

Not to mention that BMUS is really the only consistant way to play IIDX songs via 5-key. Cutting the 5-key mod on songs makes the charts feel really sketchy.

(for you stepmania/itg players, its like cutting on the add mines mod...the steps feel so hiccupy)

Besides. if you want to play 5-key, Play Beatmania/III....

Or if you want a challenge, play EZ2DJ....


oh, wait...


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DanAdamKOF
post Jun 24 2008, 10:30 PM
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I could imagine the frustration of shoehorning in some weird code for only occasional use, so I feel ya if you think it's bad enough that it should be axed.

But I'll be honest, if not for BMUS, I'd probably have no interest in the 5Key beatmanias. I was thinking that once this summer starts getting less hectic I'd go through and try to beat at ton of my old scores, and I was looking forward to redoing BMUS. But I'm sure I'd be one of a very scant few who would actually bother with BMUS's 5Key mode this late in the game.

Sucks that most of my PCs and AAAs came from BMUS's 5Key mode though :<


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VaderSeven
post Jul 18 2008, 08:58 PM
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What is the status on slaying the 5 Key mode?


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Aady
post Jul 25 2008, 07:45 AM
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I personally hatred playing on 5-key after I got utilized to playing with 7 keys. When BM US came out and the 5-key scores were counted, I felt compelled to fill them in, and it felt like a giant waste of time. although a select few 5-key songs may have some diachronic merit.
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Remy
post Jul 26 2008, 05:34 PM
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QUOTE(vaderseven @ Jul 18 2008, 09:58 PM) *
What is the status on slaying the 5 Key mode?


Soon. I'm in the middle of moving apartments so things have gotten a little derailed.


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Jadin
post Aug 2 2008, 12:57 AM
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by YOURSELF?


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Tau
post Aug 4 2008, 09:08 AM
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Nuke them. As one programmer to another I hate having to support awkwardly bolted-on functionality that doesn't fit nicely into an otherwise elegant system.


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Blue Rain
post Aug 4 2008, 11:35 AM
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i suppose just add them under 7key as like Jam Jam Reggae(5key) or something


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QUOTE (Saiyajin @ Jul 9 2009, 01:51 AM) *
Good thing there are PS2 -> PS3 adaptors... If IIDX goes triple, I'm definitely sold on the system even if though it's big enough to crush me to death in my sleep.

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