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> [PNN] Beta testing S-Challenge Support, Also: Back To The Pop'n 10 Future
Remy
post Jul 12 2007, 11:15 PM
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You've demanded it, and in a fit of productivity, it's been implemented: separate rankings for Cools/S-Challenge within PNN.

What this actually means:

Session mode has now been split in two. You'll find "Song" and "S-Challenge" in the header of each page next to session. The S-Challenge session mode looks remarkably similar to session mode, but:

- The background is pink instead of light blue.
- You will only see games that support it - Pop'n 12/13/14 (eventually). "All" is not an option I will probably be adding.
- Note counts are required.

S-Challenge has a separate view song, which has the following changes:

- The background is pink instead of light blue.
- The song dropdown list will own show songs from 12/13/14.
- Scores are now ranked by numeric score, then combo, then cools, then greats, then goods, then bads, then date. Tying is no longer possible. Same as VJA, really.

Because of this, original session mode has had cools removed as a field (yet again!), and the same column is removed from viewsong.

This code is very shaky and was written in about an hour. You will probably find things wrong with it. Please let me know what you find, as I'll be spending a chunk of time coding this weekend for the Pop'n 14 support, and now's the time to get it corrected. (You can also try and butter me up with other PNN feature requests, but remember: short requests are more likely to get done.)

Also, as a side effect of my FTP client spazzing out, I had to restore to a very old backup of session.php before doing any of this. We're talking Pop'n 10 old. There may be some features missing - I know the order of fields on the page has gotten messed up. If you catch something that's missing, let me know.


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ParaParaKing
post Jul 13 2007, 02:32 AM
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OMG! Thanks Remy. aaa.gif
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Angelus_Ov_Letum
post Jul 13 2007, 02:45 AM
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Awesome job, allthough i probably won't use this for awhile i really like how you've done this.

THANKS!
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Catastrophe
post Jul 13 2007, 03:35 AM
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Even though I don't play PNM at home, that's still really cool! (Ahahaha I'm funny.)

Yay Remy! Yay fits of productivity!


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ParaParaKing
post Jul 18 2007, 02:24 AM
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I get a lot of those error messages on the super-challenge session page:
CODE
Warning: mysql_num_rows(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 416

Warning: mysql_fetch_assoc(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 422

Warning: mysql_fetch_assoc(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 438
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Dewgy
post Jul 18 2007, 01:03 PM
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Since notecounts are required, wouldn't it make sense to include an All option anyway? As discussed in the Cools thread, you CAN access Cool timing via training mode. It changes the pass/fail requirements since you have to play with Expert gauge, but I think everyone here should be capable of being mature enough to just worry about the score itself without lying about how well they did in regards to passing.


--------------------
QUOTE(enojy)
my technique for innocent walls...
on the song select screen, simply rotate the turntable clockwise or counter-clockwise directly past innocent walls.
QUOTE(Schlagwerk)
My technique for Innocent Walls:
Take both hands off the controller. Hold my arms out straight infront of me (zombie style). Extend middle fingers.
For best experience, keep middle fingers parallel and turned upright.
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Kaze
post Jul 18 2007, 02:54 PM
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In addition to all the scripting errors on the S-Challenge page, the pop'n music 13 link at the top still links to pop'n 10.


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Remy
post Jul 23 2007, 07:20 AM
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QUOTE(ParaParaKing @ Jul 18 2007, 03:24 AM) *
I get a lot of those error messages on the super-challenge session page:
CODE
Warning: mysql_num_rows(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 416

Warning: mysql_fetch_assoc(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 422

Warning: mysql_fetch_assoc(): supplied argument is not a valid MySQL result resource in /var/www/vhosts/popnnavy.com/httpdocs/common.php on line 438


This is fixed.

QUOTE(Kaze @ Jul 18 2007, 03:54 PM) *
In addition to all the scripting errors on the S-Challenge page, the pop'n music 13 link at the top still links to pop'n 10.


This is fixed.

QUOTE(Dewgy @ Jul 18 2007, 02:03 PM) *
Since notecounts are required, wouldn't it make sense to include an All option anyway? As discussed in the Cools thread, you CAN access Cool timing via training mode. It changes the pass/fail requirements since you have to play with Expert gauge, but I think everyone here should be capable of being mature enough to just worry about the score itself without lying about how well they did in regards to passing.


No, it would not, as the notecounts for people playing on older games can't be verified.


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Dewgy
post Jul 23 2007, 04:57 PM
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QUOTE(Remy @ Jul 23 2007, 08:20 AM) *
No, it would not, as the notecounts for people playing on older games can't be verified.


Include a warning with the 11CS and earlier sheets that they're for score tracking only? I mean no offense, but it seems weird to have a feature that only mirrors what the games have and nothing more. Once I start playing with Cools I'd kind of like a way to keep track of how I'm doing when I play older stuff too. tongue.gif

Though the end call's up to you of course.

Also the formula for Cool scoring is

[(Cools/Total notes) + (Greats/2/Total notes) + (Goods/10/Total notes) + (Bads * 0)] * 100000 = Score (Decimals are truncated, not rounded

Just in case you have the time and want to implement a score checking mechanism, which could keep some of the challenging down a bit.

EDIT: Mistake in the formula, thanks otaku.


--------------------
QUOTE(enojy)
my technique for innocent walls...
on the song select screen, simply rotate the turntable clockwise or counter-clockwise directly past innocent walls.
QUOTE(Schlagwerk)
My technique for Innocent Walls:
Take both hands off the controller. Hold my arms out straight infront of me (zombie style). Extend middle fingers.
For best experience, keep middle fingers parallel and turned upright.
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over there
post Jul 23 2007, 07:11 PM
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QUOTE(Dewgy @ Jul 23 2007, 05:57 PM) *
Include a warning with the 11CS and earlier sheets that they're for score tracking only? I mean no offense, but it seems weird to have a feature that only mirrors what the games have and nothing more. Once I start playing with Cools I'd kind of like a way to keep track of how I'm doing when I play older stuff too. tongue.gif

Though the end call's up to you of course.

Also the formula for Cool scoring is

[(Cools/Total notes) + (Greats/2/Total notes) + (Goods/5/Total notes) + (Bads * 0)] * 100000 = Score (Decimals are truncated, not rounded)

Just in case you have the time and want to implement a score checking mechanism, which could keep some of the challenging down a bit.


Goods are over 5 in normal play, but in S-Challenge I'm pretty sure they're over 10. So (Goods/10/Total notes). If you can confirm your formula though, go for it.
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Kaze
post Jul 23 2007, 07:19 PM
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Personally, I'm against having ranking support for games that don't even support it. How does it seem strange that PNN would only support what the games do? That makes perfect sense. The game doesn't save scores for S-Challenge on older games, so why should PNN? I understand that there's those of you who would like to track cools scores for older games, and that's perfectly understandable, but perhaps they could just have private only support?

I mean, it's cool and all to have support for everything, but honestly, how many of you have even inputted over 10 cools scores to begin with? And between 12, 13, and 14, there's over 500 charts to readily choose from.

Again, I'm not against PNN having support for them, so long as they were for personal use only, but for ranking? The game does not save them, the games barely even support them, and there's already more than enough material to work with at the moment.

Jeez, PNN finally gets support for cools and people want more and more, eh? Hell, support for just 13 and 14 alone would've been fine for me, but hey, we even have 12 too, how sweet.


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Dewgy
post Jul 25 2007, 02:52 AM
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QUOTE(otaku1313 @ Jul 23 2007, 08:11 PM) *
Goods are over 5 in normal play, but in S-Challenge I'm pretty sure they're over 10. So (Goods/10/Total notes). If you can confirm your formula though, go for it.

Whoops, typo. Thanks for that. My bad. tongue.gif


--------------------
QUOTE(enojy)
my technique for innocent walls...
on the song select screen, simply rotate the turntable clockwise or counter-clockwise directly past innocent walls.
QUOTE(Schlagwerk)
My technique for Innocent Walls:
Take both hands off the controller. Hold my arms out straight infront of me (zombie style). Extend middle fingers.
For best experience, keep middle fingers parallel and turned upright.
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Brazoliange
post Jul 25 2007, 11:30 AM
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Unless people decide to be douchebags and try to fake scores, I don't see an issue with ranking for non-12/13/14 styles. If people want competition for it, they can make sure to know they can be challenged, but until/if there is a major issue with it, I would also ask that cool support for pre-12 (where applicable) be added with the condition that scores can still be challenged and pictures must still be provided.


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Remy
post Jul 25 2007, 08:56 PM
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QUOTE(Brazoliange @ Jul 25 2007, 12:30 PM) *
Unless people decide to be douchebags and try to fake scores, I don't see an issue with ranking for non-12/13/14 styles. If people want competition for it, they can make sure to know they can be challenged, but until/if there is a major issue with it, I would also ask that cool support for pre-12 (where applicable) be added with the condition that scores can still be challenged and pictures must still be provided.


But this is exactly the problem. If a score doesn't make any record in your game data, how do you defend against a challenge?

The methodology for the site has always been that the scores are verifiable. I can't say "these scores can be challenged" and then not provide a working process for challenges.


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Brazoliange
post Jul 26 2007, 12:19 AM
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QUOTE(Remy @ Jul 25 2007, 08:56 PM) *
But this is exactly the problem. If a score doesn't make any record in your game data, how do you defend against a challenge?

The methodology for the site has always been that the scores are verifiable. I can't say "these scores can be challenged" and then not provide a working process for challenges.


My suggestion would be that players must take a picture for every score they submit on 11th and below; most people that would bother using cools on 11th and below would be doing so for the point of tracking scores, and it would be really nice for them to have that option open. Is it a pain? Yeah. But if people are willing to do it in order to track/compete for scores for them, I would request it be left open as an option (unless, as mentioned, it was abused). i.e. give people that are willing to do the work a chance unless they prove a reason not to.

Obviously if you won't then I respect your decision, but it would be really nice to have available.

(The other obvious reason to potentially have it open is arcade, which again unless the machine was e-amuse'd would require pictures of anything entered to be taken, although almost everyone would take a picture of arcade scores in order to remember them regardless.


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ParaParaKing
post Jul 26 2007, 01:07 AM
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QUOTE(Brazoliange @ Jul 26 2007, 07:19 AM) *
(The other obvious reason to potentially have it open is arcade, which again unless the machine was e-amuse'd would require pictures of anything entered to be taken, although almost everyone would take a picture of arcade scores in order to remember them regardless.

Last time I checked arcade scores weren't allowed either.
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Kaze
post Jul 26 2007, 01:21 AM
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Last time I checked arcade scores were allowed, so long as they had no unfair advantage (ie: using 6x on a song from pop'n 8, using S-Random on a song from pop'n 6, etc)


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Kirby Kirby Kirb...
post Jul 26 2007, 11:17 AM
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QUOTE(Kaze @ Jul 26 2007, 02:21 AM) *
Last time I checked arcade scores were allowed, so long as they had no unfair advantage (ie: using 6x on a song from pop'n 8, using S-Random on a song from pop'n 6, etc)


QUOTE
You agree not to enter scores from simulators, arcade versions, or your imagination under penalty of removal from the site.

from PNN:Rules @ Wiki
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Brazoliange
post Jul 26 2007, 11:56 AM
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I also recalled that PNN was fine with Arcade scores as opposed to VJA, as was partly evidenced by Kaze's Chin-Don 100k. There's also the fact that arcade timing is just as strict as home version timing, the controller is identical to a KASC, clearing is actually harder at arcade than home, timing varies between versions but that'd be same as CS and each version of AC has the same timing, etc.


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Dewgy
post Jul 26 2007, 02:43 PM
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QUOTE(Remy @ Jul 25 2007, 09:56 PM) *
But this is exactly the problem. If a score doesn't make any record in your game data, how do you defend against a challenge?

The methodology for the site has always been that the scores are verifiable. I can't say "these scores can be challenged" and then not provide a working process for challenges.

That would be a problem for exact verification, but all a user would need to do in this case is prove that an older score is believable by getting a similar result and snapping a picture. If people have an issue with this affecting competition, make all of the scores for those games permanently private, or at least unranked, just so those of us who want a way to track our own scores on older games have a way to.


--------------------
QUOTE(enojy)
my technique for innocent walls...
on the song select screen, simply rotate the turntable clockwise or counter-clockwise directly past innocent walls.
QUOTE(Schlagwerk)
My technique for Innocent Walls:
Take both hands off the controller. Hold my arms out straight infront of me (zombie style). Extend middle fingers.
For best experience, keep middle fingers parallel and turned upright.
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